>> All right. You guys ready to do this? >> Yeah! >> Oh, come on. You can do better than that. Ready to do this? >> Yeah! >> If you have a bean bag, slap that bean bag right now. I want to hear it. All right. That means you're a reader, because you're here with energy. My name is Michael Cavna, Washington Post. I'm a cartoonist and a comics columnist, and I've loved comics my whole life and love graphic novelists. And you guys are in for a treat because right now, we have two of the best working in the business. We have Shannon Hale. You guys may know her. Yes. Yes. You may know the Ever After High series or Princess Academy. Anyone? With her husband, Rapunzel's Revenge, Calamity Jack, Unbeatable Squirrel Girl, which, personal favorite. The Princess in Black series, right? Man. Man, you guys may be rumbling later with each other. It sounds like we have a lot of factions for these books. And her sidekick and her partner in creating this new series, as well as Princess in Black, LeUyen Pham, right here. ^M00:01:13 [ Applause ] ^M00:01:16 As an artist, you may know her from Big Sister, Little Sister, or the Bear Who Wasn't There and/or The Boy Who Loved Math. Anyone know boys who love math, I'm hearing right now. So they've both come here from the west side of the country to be here to entertain you guys, and two years ago they came out with Real Friends, fans, and now just four days ago, they came out with Best Friends. It is awesome. You guys seriously got to pick it up, because it looks like this. It's the purple one, just go to the bookstore and say I want the purple one. Shannon, LeUyen, welcome to this stage. A big hand, you guys. Here they are! ^M00:01:55 [ Applause ] ^M00:01:58 >> Hey, I'm Shannon Hale. >> Hi, and I'm LeUyen Pham. >> And our new book is Best Friends. >> Woo-hoo. Sorry. >> That's you. This is the first story that I made up. I drew this picture when I was in kindergarten. It was about a witch with long, green fingernails that ate babies. So I started as a visual storyteller. >> I did, too, but I would draw on the insides of books. So as you can see, librarians, close your eyes, but I used the dictionary and I drew my version of what I thought was a perfect little princess right there. She did not have green nails and ate no children, so mine's G-rated, thank you. >> As long as you know. As long as you know. >> Yeah, yeah. >> So this is me in fourth grade, and this is the year that I had a teacher that started us writing stories. >> And this is me in fourth grade. And I was always the class artist in the class, the one kid that could draw all the time. It was the one thing everybody knew me as, and so it's definitely the year I started charging for drawings. So I'm going to officially say that was when I became a real illustrator. I would draw Star Wars characters for like 25 cents a copy. >> And this is me in middle school. So when I was in fourth grade and I said I want to be a writer, people would say, you can do it! You can do anything! And then when I was in middle school and I said I wanted to be a writer, they started to say, it's pretty tough. You might want to keep your options open. >> This is me in middle school. This is when I started being told that you weren't going to make it as an artist. You know how that horrible moment happens? Like, you can't make it. Get a real job, kind of thing. That's when I started thinking, maybe I'm not going to become an artist. I don't know. That's when peer pressure sets in and you start getting worried about what you look like and who you hang out with and seventh grade is a hard year, I'll tell you. >> Here I am in high school. At this point, I still was writing, but secretly, because I thought it was embarrassing to want to be a writer. Because I thought everybody wanted to be a writer, and who was I to think that I actually could pull it off? >> You could pull it off. Here I am. I'm the cheerleader and about ready to go off -- >> She was a cheerleader, guys! >> A cheerleader. >> [inaudible] like fifteen years and I didn't know this until last year, and I think this was crucial information. >> I know, right? It really -- >> She was voted most popular. >> No I wasn't! >> Weren't you? >> No, no. >> Most likely to succeed. >> No. Most likely to succeed. >> Yeah, you know. >> That's where we all ended up. >> I was not. >> Whoops, skip that. Okay, and then -- >> Oh, so I graduated from college, but then I really, I knew there was nothing else that was going to make me happy besides being a writer. So I decided to take a plunge. I decided to go to graduate school in creative writing and that was the first time -- it was very scary for me to admit out loud, this is what I want to do and really try to go for it. >> Yeah. And in the meantime, I went off to UCLA thinking I'm going to be a lawyer like everyone told me to do. And after two years, ended up switching over to an art school. And I'm going to tell you guys all, for everyone who says you can't make it as an artist and blah-blah-blah, it was like realizing for the first time who I was. For the first time. So don't ever let anyone tell you that you can't do that. But I went off to become an artist while Shannon -- sorry. >> Was getting rejected. While LeUyen had immediate and astounding success. I spent years with people telling me no, no, no, no. And that's not a unique story. I mean, we all go through it. Even if you don't want to be a writer or artist or have that impossible dream, we all get rejected every single day. And even though I am now published and best selling and whatever, I still get rejected all the time. It's just the reality. Everyone does, except for LeUyen. But I have now, at this point, published over 30 books. >> And I've done over 100 books. I think I'm at 110 now, yeah. ^M00:05:56 [ Applause ] ^M00:05:58 Thank you, thank you. And I look so young. No, I'm joking. ^M00:06:02 [ Laughing ] ^M00:06:05 >> Oh, some of my books are The Goose Girl Series, gone, next one, yeah. Rapunzel's Revenge, Calamity Jack, go faster, Princess Academy, oh, and -- >> In the meantime, she's off writing books and I'm off going to art school and these are some of the paintings I did when I was in art school. I went out of art school and I went into animation. Yeah, I know. There are always these gasps, oh, who made that movie, Spirit? Yes, I did some character designs on Spirit and I worked on the backgrounds on some of these other movies as well. But I didn't like it. I went off and I started to do children's books. So these are a few of my children's books. I know, like you'll think, LeUyen Pham, how do you pronounce her name? But odds are, one of you guys has one of my books somewhere at your house and just didn't know it was mine. I'm also, do you guys know who this character is? She's my character. I'm the creator of the Vampirina Ballerina series. Woo-hoo. ^M00:06:58 [ Applause ] ^M00:07:00 Do you guys know what this is? >> Who's symbol is that? Yes. So my husband and I wrote a Young Wonder Woman, the first middle grade graphic novel about Wonder Woman, and that comes out in January. >> January. >> And how about this? Do you know who that is? Squirrel Girl. So again, with my husband I wrote two Squirrel Girl novels. And do you know who this is? ^M00:07:25 [ Cheering ] ^M00:07:29 With my husband I wrote and LeUyen illustrated, we've got Book Seven coming out. >> Book Seven. >> In November. >> Yes, and we're working on Book Eight right now. >> And Book Seven is the funniest one. It really is. All my kids tell me so. Well, we also did, besides Princess in Black, we did Real Friends together. So Real Friends is a true story. It's the first true story that I've told. And it starts with me. That's little me in kindergarten, and I was a really anxious little kid. I didn't want to start school, because I was afraid. I wanted to stay with my mom. But I met a best friend named Adrian. And everything was going to be okay, because I had a best friend. But by the time I got to be in third grade, there I am in third grade, so cute, my best friend who was smart and pretty and everything, she joined what was called The Group. The Group was the group of the most popular third grade girls in our school. And because Adrian was so cool, she was automatically a member of The Group. And because I was her best friend, I was kind of a member, but I really wasn't cool enough to be one. I know it's hard to imagine, because I'm so cool now. >> She's so cool. >> But at the time, I was not -- I know -- considered cool. But I could make up cool stories and games, so they liked me for my ability to make up games to play. But by the time I was in fourth grade, it just started getting really rough. There was just a lot of anxiety of every day, am I going to have friends when I go to school today? Am I not going to have friends? It felt like being trapped on a boat and if the sea was stormy, then I got tossed around. You see on that boat, there's no controls. That's one thing I love about graphic novels is LeUyen can draw an image and you immediately understand how that feels without even reading any words. >> Yeah. It's always -- actually images like this are always great for me, because sometimes I don't operate very well with words and I can only operate with pictures. And when I can show something like this, when Shannon says this is how I felt, like having sticks and stones thrown at me, it's so much more of a release for me to be able to draw it in something like this. >> And you know the phrase sticks and stones may break my bones, but words will never hurt me, but they kind of still do, don't they? So this is our second book. This is Best Friends, and this takes place all in sixth grade. I think sixth grade is an interesting year. >> Yeah. >> And in sixth grade, I was doing pretty well. I was best friends with the most popular girl in school, and it was kind of like being the princess of the whole school. But also in sixth grade, things get really tricky. ^M00:10:03 Like here's a scene where I'm wondering if this boy who keeps looking at me, does he like me? Because things started to change between boys and girls in sixth grade. This is part of -- from my journal. LeUyen, will you read it? >> I'm going to read this. A boy in school named so-and-so is being really nice to me, but in a shy sort of way. Sometimes, out of the corner of my eye, I can see him looking at me. He's okay, but king of small and weird. I think he likes me. In a rating call, he rated me as seven and a half in looks and personality, but he rated a girl eight when I never see them talk or anything. I wonder a lot about it. >> So we took those memories and those journal entries and put them into the book. Here is the scene of the rating call, which was an incredibly stupid thing we used to do, where we would call boys in our class and ask them to rate us and the other girls from one to 10. Do not do this. This is a mistake. >> Asking for judgment at that age, what are you thinking? >> No. But this was the age where I started to become very conscious that girls, we were told we were supposed to be pretty and I didn't even really know what that meant. And that constant question hanging over my head, am I pretty? Am I pretty enough? When people look at me, do they think I'm pretty? And it seemed to matter more than anything. Here's another journal entry. >> That's the fun part. I don't love any boys. I just liked a few and -- but I don't love any. Some are kind of fun to be around, though. Jen told Nicole that she didn't like me. Nicole told me, but Jen is acting like she never said anything. >> It's so confusing. Every day it changes. Are we friends? Are we not friends? So it's very cathartic to put this all into the book. Here's another one. >> I feel like an outcast in the group. No one seems to like me. At so-and-so's party, they played mean tricks on me. When they told me what they did while I was asleep, I said thanks. And they got mad at me for being upset! >> Have any of you felt that way? Has that ever happened, something like that, to you? What? >> Nobody? >> Like four of you? >> None of you have ever been a sixth grade person before? >> Congratulations. >> Yeah. >> Really, in sixth grade, it felt like friendships were a game, but the rules were constantly changing, and it seemed like everybody else had updated rules except for me. Oh, there I am. That's a picture of me with a fake monkey and a real dog. Just to clarify. >> I'm not sure why it's in there, but it makes sense. Let's see, there were six girls here and another party when six boys came up. We danced and stuff. My mom was being really nice. I love her and feel close to her. Blank, the guy having the party, is really cool. I like him. Gift of the Sea, one of the books I am writing, along -- I'm worried about -- I can't seem to write anymore. >> Here's the party where the boys came and we started to do these little dances. That was fun. And here's the book I was writing in sixth grade. One fun thing about Best Friends is throughout the book, we put little chapters from the book I was writing between the stuff that was actually happening. And here is one of those images. You see, it starts with me in the real world and I start typing on the computer and it moves into the fantasy story I was writing. Do you want to -- >> I'm going to read a couple. >> This is a real story that I was writing. >> So I have to say, as an illustrator, this is so much fun to illustrate. The story an 11-year-old girl is writing, it fulfils every childhood fantasy of mine. The waves rushed against Alexandra's ankles, but they couldn't wash away her sadness. Alexandra sighed. Some girls would give anything to be the daughter of a multi-millionaire. What wouldn't she give to have normal parents and go to a normal school? It was lonely being an only child. No sisters to talk to. Shannon has like four brothers and sisters, by the way. And now that she was home for the summer, the boarding school friends were far away. Never mind all that, I'm going to be just fine, said Alexandra. Because she was a brave girl with great potential and never stayed sad for long. >> Unlike actual me. It was very cathartic, though, to be writing a fantasy novel about a girl that had so much power when I felt like I had so little. >> Yes. >> I have an anxiety disorder and I get into that in the book and how that feels, to be trying to be normal and go through every day, but inside you've got this voice and these feelings telling you how worthless you are. I'm going to tell you one more quick story about Best Friends and let's move on. So one time, we used to go to this amusement park called Lagoon. And in sixth grade, for the first time, I went with a big group of friends, boys and girls. There were five girls and four boys. The boys decided to play a game, and they all won a stuffed animal. The four boys decided to give their stuffed animal each to one of the girls. So again, five girls, four boys. Guess who didn't get one? If you guessed me, you were right. Then another girl, a sixth girl showed up. So one of the boys immediately went back to the game and played again so he could win another stuffed animal and he gave it to her. So six girls, five of them had stuffed animals. And I'm really trying to keep it together, because I used to get teased for crying at recess and I'm really trying not to cry. I'm really trying to hold it in, but then I turn around the corner and there's my mom with my little brother and sister. And I see her notice and realize what's going on. And I have to cover my chin, because when I'm trying not to cry, my chin starts to quiver, and I'm trying to hide that I'm feeling any emotion, because I don't want to be teased. >> And, of course she does. These are -- >> These would be tough. >> Really, really hard stories to illustrate, because, of course, every kid goes through these moments, like everyone goes through these moments, but you feel so alone when you're actually going through that moment. For me, especially, to have to live through Shannon, and remember moments like that for me, to draw these moments, it's just crushing to me, absolutely crushing. But -- >> We -- >> Revisionist history. >> So LeUyen and I and our editor, Connie, I took them to Lagoon Amusement Park. >> The real one. >> We went on the terror ride. We went on the rollercoaster that gave me so much trauma. >> Yes -- >> And it still did. LeUyen tried funnel cakes for the first time. >> Funnel cakes. Never had it. >> And then, Utah, jello salad is a big thing, which is basically like jello mixed with Cool Whip. >> Only in Utah. >> You can tell her expression was not fond of this. It's a Utah staple. And then, heroically, they insisted on playing a game and winning a stuffed animal. >> She was the only one that got it, by the way. Guess who didn't get it this time? >> And there's the goat they won me. >> Woo-hoo. >> So all is mended. It gets better. >> It does. ^M00:16:51 [ Applause ] ^M00:16:53 >> So when you're younger, the world is limited. Your choices are limited. There's so much emotion. And things can be really hard. But one thing LeUyen and I really believe is that everybody has their own kinds of superpowers and we lean on those to get through. Do you know what mine is? What is mine? >> Writing. >> Writing, yes. The writing and the storytelling, that was my safe place. That's how I got through. What's LeUyen's superpower? >> What's mine? >> Drawing. >> Drawing. I love drawing. In fact, it's the way I made friends when I was younger and I was so shy. I would make friends by doing drawings and still, even now, when you see like those long lines [inaudible] signing, sometimes I have no idea what to say and I'm embarrassed and I'm shy, and the only thing I can do is just draw for you, which is what we're going to do -- >> We're going to do it now. >> Right now. We've got a little bit of time. >> And do we have a volunteer that doesn't mind coming up and being on camera. Right here. Will you come up? Hop up real quick. >> She's a redhead. >> So -- >> We know all about redheads. >> We are going to turn you into a superpower. >> Come on. >> Get your superhero. What do you think -- what is a talent or a thing that you love? >> Reading. >> Reading, okay. >> Reading. >> So stand right here. >> What's your name? >> Eleanor. >> Eleanor? This is Eleanor. She -- >> Eleanor. >> Eleanor. >> Okay. I honestly couldn't see that she was a redhead in the dark, there, but it really feels like me fulfilling some kind of weird -- >> I know. With the freckles and everything. This is -- did you know she, Shannon, has told me all this stuff about redheads. You have like a -- >> You have -- >> High tolerance for pain. >> You're going to need 20% more anesthetic, okay? >> Did you know that? >> When you go to the dentist, you tell him, I need 20% more anesthesia than you normally give. And if you need a C-section at some point, be aware of that. It's real, people, look it up. Peer reviewed studies. >> All right, we're going to turn Eleanor into a book reading superhero, okay? So what kind of elements like should we give you like a badge that's got like a book on it or something? I'm going to start drawing you while you tell me what you think your costume should look like. Or Shannon, you can help her, too. >> What do you think? Cape? >> There should be a cape with a book on it. >> A cape with a book on it. Do you think kind of like a dress or a jumpsuit or a Spandex suit or like action shorts or what kind of -- loungewear if you're reading? >> Loungewear? >> What do you think? Pajamas, like superhero pajamas? >> Superhero pajamas? >> Like more of a jumpsuit. >> Jumpsuit. >> Jumpsuit, okay. Always the superheroes have to have that space to run around it. >> But they can have pockets, like book-sized pockets. >> Should you have a mask? Do you want a mask? >> Sure. >> Okay, a mask. Let's do the mask. I always ask, because once you put a mask on, it stops looking like the person, but we all know it kind of looks like her, right? So now I can put the mask on, because it's not supposed to look like her technically anymore. >> Now we don't recognize her anymore. She could be anybody. >> There. Now you could be anybody. Wow. This is amazing. Let me see. I'm going to have your hair like flying triumphantly behind you, okay? And I'm going to have you standing in like a very triumphant pose. Do you want a cape at all? >> Sure. >> Okay. Let's do a cape. ^M00:20:00 >> Yeah, Incredibles have no capes, but that's because it cost too much to animate. We all know capes are cool. >> Would you like a little flippy skirt or do you want like a full-on jumpsuit? >> Full-on jumpsuit. >> Full-on jumpsuit. Full-on jumpsuit like this. I'm not joking. When I was a kid, I would charge people drawings of them like standing next to Chewbacca for 25 cents. I made a killing in fourth grade. >> No one bought my stories in fourth grade. >> You needed an illustrator, that's why. All right, hold on. Wait, and then we need like a symbol. Should it be an open book? But she's a superhero with a hidden identity. >> I like the name The Open Book for a superhero name. >> All right, hold on. >> The Open Book. >> The Open Book. >> It sounds like she's there and available to help and also sounds like she has the knowledge to solve any problem. >> Look at that. >> Is that an okay name? Eleanor's your real name. You need a secret superhero name. >> Yeah. >> That's -- and then the cape. >> The cape. So you just add the flare. >> Flying behind you. Like that. And your superhero name is The Open Book? The Open Book. There we go. >> It's a very pulp name. It's very classic superhero. Yes. Very nice. ^M00:21:17 [ Applause ] ^M00:21:19 All right. We have two minutes. We have time for one more. >> Time for one more. Let's pick -- why don't we pick one of the bean bag girls over here. [inaudible] you. Come on up. Did anyone have any questions while we're doing these drawings? Maybe Shannon can answer some questions while I'm drawing. >> What's your name? >> I'm Maddy. >> Maddy. All right. And tell me -- tell me a talent you have or something that you love. >> Dance. >> Dance. >> All right. I'm turning her into the Dance Queen. You can answer some questions. >> Okay. Does anybody have any questions for me or LeUyen or both? Yeah? What do we do when we get stuck on a problem? So I have -- my personal philosophy is when people, you know, have you guys heard of the term writer's block? It's just a fancy way of saying I am having a hard time writing. But the truth is, writing is hard. If I told you write 1000 words in the next hour and it doesn't matter what they are, could you do it? Yes! So writer's block is the fear of not doing it perfectly the first time. So I give myself permission to do it badly, and I write really, really badly, but I have something there. And then I always tell myself after -- when I'm writing a first draft of something that what I'm doing is shoveling sand into a box so that later I can build castles. And then I rewrite. And honestly, it just takes lots of years of practice of reading and living and writing before I had the skills to revise. All right, other questions? Yes? How do you get inspiration for writing books? Just by living, honestly. Just every day. With Princess in Black, how that happened was my four-year-old was wearing a skirt with butterflies on it and she was pointing to the different colors and she said pink is a girl color, and purple is a girl color, but not black. And my first thought was what? Who says colors have genders? That's like the weirdest thing. I was like I don't even know where that came from, but of course girls can wear black, and she said princesses don't wear black. And I went, oh, the princess in black. And that's how that started. All right. Are we about done here with Maddy? >> Yeah, but we don't have her super symbol. What should her super symbol be? >> Super symbol. Like a star or a -- >> A star? You want a big old star? >> I think something really simple and eye-catching is always the best for a simple -- >> Just like that? Are we good with that? >> Yeah, I like that. >> Good. >> Super hero name? Super hero. >> The Dance Queen. >> The Dance Queen. >> The Dance Queen! Dancing Queen! >> Young and sweet. >> Woo-hoo! >> All right. Are we out of time? >> No! >> I can't read it. Wrap it up, it says! >> Wrap it up. Do we have any more questions? >> Last question. Yeah, go ahead. >> Uhm, do the stories you write when -- I mean, when you wrote when you were a kid give you inspiration for your books now? >> The -- yeah, absolutely. The stuff you drew when you were younger, did it give you inspiration? >> Yes, absolutely. Everything that I drew when I was younger, I kind of kept and I remember making like fairy tales when I was a kid and then putting my friends in them all the time. And to this day, every book that I do contains people that I know for real. So everything, everything. >> Well, we are out of time, but we're going to be signing in an hour, and feel free to ask us questions if you come to the signing line. Thank you so much! >> Thank you guys!