>> Neely Tucker: Hi, I'm Neely Tucker. I'm from the Library of Congress. Absolutely none of you came to see me. So [laughs] I'm doing a brief introduction, and then I'll get out of your way. You are here to see Rainbow Rowell. ^M00:00:13 [ Applause ] ^M00:00:16 The new book is Pumpkinheads, which she is collaborating with Faith Erin Hicks. ^M00:00:22 [ Applause and laughs ] ^M00:00:26 And our moderator is Linda Holmes. ^M00:00:28 [ Applause ] ^M00:00:31 And I hope you guys have a terrific time. Please try to behave yourselves. There will be questions at the end and have a great time. Ladies. >> Absolutely. >> Yay. ^M00:00:39 [ Applause ] ^M00:00:42 >> Linda Holmes: Hi, You guys. Hi, you guys >> Hey. >> Hi, Linda. >> Linda Holmes: I'm Linda. If you don't know me I work at NPR, and I'm the host of a podcast called Pop Culture Happy Hour. ^M00:00:52 [ Applause and laughs ] ^M00:00:55 >> Linda Holmes: And as I was bragging to Faith early, oh, so that's my book, which is called Every Day Starts Over. >> Yeah, very good. I recommend it, efficiently. >> Linda Holmes: And as I was telling Faith earlier I am a - I was an early Rainbow Rowell adopter, because attachments. I'm one of those people who listen to bands before they were cool. >> Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: And tells you all the time. Attachments came across. My desk is like a cold. It just came across my desk cold. I didn't know Rainbow. I was enthused about the description and immediately became a big Rainbow fan. And so - >> Rainbow Rowell: And I followed you on Twitter and you tweeted about it and I fell out of bed. I was so like [inaudible]. >> Linda Holmes: So Rainbow and I have gone back and forth for a long time. She was an early helper. I was explaining to Faith. She also was one of my early, like, is this anything of sending like 15 pages of the book that I wanted to write? So -- >> Faith Erin Hicks: And you wrote it even after I told you to stop. [Laughs] >> Linda Holmes: So Rainbow and I have known each other a long time, and Faith and I have just met today. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yes. >> Linda Holmes: But Rainbow and Faith's book, one of you - Faith, why don't you talk a little bit about what Pumpkinheads is for people who haven't yet had a chance to read it. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Okay. Pumpkinheads is a wonderful fall themed graphic novel. It is a story about two teenagers, Deja and Josiah, and they've worked at this amazing pumpkin patch. The best pumpkin patch in Nebraska for all of their high school. >> Rainbow Rowell: That's really saying something too. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: We have pretty good pumpkin patches. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. It's this amazing pumpkin patch, and they worked at this pumpkin patch all throughout high school, and it's their very last night working at this pumpkin patch, and then they're going to go off to separate colleges. And together they decide that they're going to go on an adventure. Josiah is finally going to go and talk to this girl that he's had a crush on, an unrequited crush for the past three years. And Deja is going to accompany Josiah as a friend on his adventure, and also she's going to get to taste her favorite snacks in the pumpkin patch one last time. >> Linda Holmes: Snacks are big in the pumpkin patch. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yes. >> Linda Holmes: It's sort of like if you've ever been to, I don't know if you remember, like the Minnesota State Fair, which I used to go to sometimes where they have all the, you know, every year it's a new thing. Like the year it was alligator on a stick. I have had alligator on a stick. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Like actual alligator? >> Linda Holmes: Yeah, alligator on a stick, fried alligator on a stick. [Laughs] So the pumpkin patch it tastes like, you know what's weird? >> Rainbow Rowell: It tastes like chicken. >> Linda Holmes: It tastes like a cross between chicken and fish, which makes perfect sense if you think about it. >> Faith Erin Hicks: I'd just like to say I'm from Canada, [laughs] so I don't know. >> Rainbow Rowell: It won't be the first time she says it. >> Linda Holmes: So the pumpkin patch is very snack centric. So Deja going out and getting all her snacks is very important. >> Rainbow Rowell: Absolutely. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yes. >> Linda Holmes: So why don't you talk about Rainbow, talk about the sort of the origin of this idea, because I know if you read the book there is some material at the end where you guys talk some about the creation of the book. >> Rainbow Rowell: Right. >> Linda Holmes: Talk about where this came from for you. >> Rainbow Rowell: So in Nebraska, have you guys been to Pumpkin patches? >> Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah, I bet you have. Here in Washington D.C., I'm sure you think you've been to a pumpkin patch. ^M00:04:08 [ Laughs ] ^M00:04:10 >> Rainbow Rowell: We have in Nebraska kind of pumpkin patch culture. I actually don't know if this is true. Like, Omaha, we have kind of competing pumpkin patches, and so they've really went up to each other for so many years that they've become extraordinary. And so every year it's really a thing for us. Like, you don't just go to the pumpkin patch once. There's somebody nodding, so I feel like maybe they've been here to Omaha. Yeah, that you're the person I'm finding about. [Laughs] Don't come to Omaha. It's not a very nice place to visit. No one's laughing because they think it's sad, but It's true. Omaha is kind of hot all the time and cold all the time. And the only great time to be there is October. So if you come, come in October, and like we live it up in October. Like we just can't get enough. So we have season passes at the pumpkin patch. [Laughs] Not just me, but like everyone. >> Linda Holmes: And you don't just go to the pumpkin patch to get your pumpkin for Halloween? >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, no. No. The actual pumpkin patch is a tiny part of the pumpkin patch. >> Linda Holmes: I see. >> Rainbow Rowell: It's more like a county fair that's only open for like a month of the year. >> Linda Holmes: Right. >> Rainbow Rowell: And there are dog shows, and there's pumpkin cannons, and there's apple picking, and there's, I mean, I could just keep going. There's haunted houses. There's ride a pony, ride a donkey, ride a tricycle. Ride a lot of things at the pumpkin patch. So every time I'm there I'm like, oh, this would be a great YA story, like a great place to put away a story at the pumpkin patch. And so I've been thinking about it for a really long time, and I kept thinking like, there are a couple other YA writers who might get there before me. Like, Stephanie Perkins seems like she would do that. Right. Yeah. She's already had a Christmas tree farm. Jeff Zentner [assumed spelling] calls himself the king of fall. He actually has a gourd tattoo, I think. So I really felt this pressure to write a story in a pumpkin patch before those other people got there. >> Linda Holmes: Sure. >> Linda Holmes: And so how did the collaboration come about? >> Rainbow Rowell: Well, we met the traditional way on Twitter. >> Linda Holmes: Yes. >> Faith Erin Hicks: As you do. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: That's where I get all my jobs. >> Rainbow Rowell: That's where I get all my friends. >> Linda Holmes: Faith, you are - >> Rainbow Rowell: I met you on Twitter. >> Linda Holmes: And you were experienced both with graphic novels that you did yourself? >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yes. >> Linda Holmes: And graphic novels that you did in collaboration with writers or - >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yes. >> Linda Holmes: - other -- >> Faith Erin Hicks: Pumpkinheads is my 14th published graphic novel. And of those 14, about half I've written and drawn myself, and half are collaborations with other writers. And then sometimes I get to write graphic novels for other artists to draw. Right now I'm the writer on Avatar, the Last Air Bender comics. ^M00:06:45 [ Applause ] ^M00:06:48 >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. So, I write those comics and they're drawn by a great American artist named Peter Wartman, who is awesome. And, yeah, that I love collaborating with other people, because I feel like I get the opportunity to try a different kind of story than what I might come up with. And I was a huge fan of Rainbow's work. I'd read Fan Girl. I'd read Eleanor and Park. I actually read everything you'd published up until that point. >> Rainbow Rowell: Thank you. Thank you very much. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And I believe for a second our publisher approached you at first and just asked. >> Rainbow Rowell: Somebody tweeted at me saying you should write a graphic novel for a second. And I tweeted back semi-colon end parentheses, that would be great. [Laughs] And then the editor called me and said, no, she emailed me and said, "Do you really want to write a graphic novel or are you just flirting with us on Twitter?" And I was like, well, both. [Laughs]. And so I agreed to write a graphic novel for a second kind of site unseen for both sides. Like we just really didn't know how that would work out. And then we got, we have like an arranged relationship through that editor. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. Yes. >> Rainbow Rowell: Which is unusual. >> Faith Erin Hicks: It is unusual. So typically if I'm hired as an artist to draw a graphic novel, usually the script is already written or at least there's like an outline, so I know what kind of project I'm signing onto. With Pumpkinheads there was pretty much nothing. >> Rainbow Rowell: There was nothing. No idea. >> Faith Erin Hicks: There was just like, do you want to work with this lady? >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: I was like, heck, yes, I do. >> Rainbow Rowell: It could have gone so wrong for Faith. I only thought about that now for both of us really. Like, would you consent to work on a massive artistic project with someone for two years without having like met them? We did. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: We just [inaudible] and do it having known each other's work. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah, just dove straight in. >> Linda Holmes: Had you done any of this stuff that you've done with Marvel at that time or no? >> Rainbow Rowell: No. So I agreed to write it for a second. I wrote the script for Faith, and then because our schedules kind of had to coincide and overlap in the right way. I went and started working for Marvel and had been writing Runaways for about a year. Thank you for, and then Faith came on. ^M00:08:51 [ Applause ] ^M00:08:52 >> Rainbow Rowell: Okay. Thank you. I'm really happy. Please buy her book. It's going to get canceled if you don't. ^M00:08:55 [ Laughs ] ^M00:08:57 >> Rainbow Rowell: So and even if you do, maybe. ^M00:08:58 [ Applause ] ^M00:08:59 >> Linda Holmes: So what were the first things that you kind of exchanged between the two of you? What's the first thing that comes, I assume from Rainbow to you? >> Rainbow Rowell: I mean, she got the whole script all at once. Yeah. So she got the whole script. I had pitched a different idea when we met. We met in Toronto at T-cath, and I pitched a different idea, kind of like an Alice in Wonderlandy fantasy, which Faith was super enthusiastic about. >> Linda Holmes: Still pumpkin patch or no? >> Rainbow Rowell: No, totally not pumpkin patch. >> Linda Holmes: Because Alice in Wonderland is a pumpkin patch is also a good idea. >> Rainbow Rowell: I mean, I could do that too. Don't take it, Linda. ^M00:09:29 [ Laughs ] ^M00:09:33 >> Linda Holmes: TM, me and Rainbow. Go ahead. >> Rainbow Rowell: And it's funny because Faith said yes to that idea, but now she's told me she had a lot of ideas about it. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah, reservations. So like I just, I was a fan of Rainbow, and I was willing to do whatever she came up with. You know, like whatever idea she wanted me to draw I was there, because I was just such a big fan of her work. And initially this Alice in Wonderland idea, I remember it had a lot of like fantasy animal creatures in it. Like I think there was like -- >> Rainbow Rowell: There's like a hot raccoon guy. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Hot raccoon guy. ^M00:10:03 [ Applause ] ^M00:10:04 >> Rainbow Rowell: And I've never written animals, so she had no reason to think that. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah, exactly. And like to be honest, I don't like drawing animals. Like I really don't. Like, there's just, I don't like drawing animals at all, but it's like I was willing to do it for her, you know, like I was ready to do it. But then when she changed her mind and came up with Pumpkinheads, I was like, oh my God. And like, I was like, Oh my God, dodged that bullet. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. ^M00:10:26 [ Applause ] ^M00:10:28 >> Rainbow Rowell: Dodged that hot raccoon guy. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah, the hot raccoon guy. >> Linda Holmes: So you sent the script? >> Rainbow Rowell: I sent the script. >> Linda Holmes: And then you start having conversations about the look of it? >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. I mean, when I write is kind of like a screenplay, the way that I did it with Faith. So I write kind of like more information than she would need. Like, this is how it feels, this is what it looks like. This is what I think. And so it's kind of like a long screenplay. And then she took it and immediately did start doing some sketches. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. When I got the script from Rainbow I sat down and read it all in one sitting, and it was immediately just like so excited about it. It's kind of an amazing thing to get a script from a writer and immediately be enthusiastic about drawing it to just like see the images in your head and just be like so ready to dive into it. And at the time, I think you gave me the script in like 2016, 2017? >> Rainbow Rowell: I can't remember. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. One of those two years, and I was still working. I did a middle grade fantasy trilogy called the Nameless City, and I was still in the middle of drawing those comics. So I wasn't going to be available for at least another year to draw Pumpkinheads, and I was immediately like, oh, I just want to like quit this book that I'm working on and dive right into Pumpkinheads. And I immediately sat down and drew the proto version of Deja and Josiah, like the next day after reading the script. I was just so inspired by it. It, I don't know, like I can't say that enough. Like it is a really unique thing to be given us as an artist to be given a script to be so inspired to be ready to draw this thing, because it's like, you know, comics are very, very time consuming to make. Like, it will typically take me a year to draw a graphic novel from start to finish. And you don't want to be sitting there grinding out pages on something that you're just not enthusiastic about drawing. Like, I've done it because comics are my job, but I'd much rather be inspired and work with a collaborator that I'm excited about. >> Linda Holmes: And one thing I noticed about Pumpkinheads is that even though Pumpkinheads is very much a story of these two friends, and they're on this sort of, they're on this journey over the course of this evening, it also has a lot of like actions sequences. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, it does. >> Linda Holmes: And as somebody who like I read some comics, but not a ton, and I've read some graphic novels, but not a ton. >> Faith Erin Hicks: You should read more. ^M00:12:44 [ Applause ] ^M00:12:46 >> Linda Holmes: It's always interesting to me to see how, you know, essentially an action sequence, something racing past something else. Do you have those conversations about what the, what the pacing should look like? Does it tend to come from Faith in a way where you say, yes, I totally, this is totally what I had in mind? >> Rainbow Rowell: I write it like for Faith, I write my runaways comics different. I've written them a little bit more panel by panel, because there's a limited amount of space and things have to happen in a certain way. >> Linda Holmes: Right. >> Rainbow Rowell: And you have to be super conscious of page turns. But for Faith, we had talked ahead of time about - Faith is very good at pacing, especially at conversations and emotional stuff. So what I did is I wrote it like a screenplay. So I wrote what you would see. So I would write like an a goat comes by, and then the people chasing the goat come by, and then the people with pitchforks come by. Like, I would write it like that. >> Linda Holmes: Right. >> Rainbow Rowell: But then she kind of takes that and interprets it her way and she decides how to make that, you probably should dive in. I'm saying how you do your job. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Oh, yeah. Basically [laughs] the paneling. So I basically took Rainbow's screenplay and broke it down and put it in the paneling and turned it into a comic. But, I mean, I don't think like our jobs were separate on this book. >> Linda Holmes: Right. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Like I feel like we worked incredibly closely as collaborators. Again, which made this book very, very different from my previous collaborations, because most of the time it's like I'm handed a script. >> Linda Holmes: Right. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And then the writer just usually goes away until I'm done drawing it and then they give me notes. But Pumpkinheads was very different. Like, I got the screenplay. I took it, thumb nailed it out, broke it down into comic book panels, rewrote it, pass out that off to Rainbow, and then she gave me notes on the comic script. >> Linda Holmes: Right. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And then we went back and forth on the artwork when I sat down to started drawing. And I feel like the book really benefits from that because I feel like when you read it, there's no like schism between writer and artists. Like, I feel like we mesh really, really well on the book, and it's almost like obviously you wrote it, and I drew it, but it's like I read it and it's like I can't really tell where you end and I begin. I just feel like it's a very unique collaboration. And I feel like we were lucky, because you don't always have the time when you're writing, when you're drawing a graphic novel to have that kind of collaboration. >> Rainbow Rowell: That's kind of like I tell her this is how I see it, and then she sends it back to me, like, okay, kind of like this is. And then, and I might say like, oh no, not quite like that. What about this? Or I might say, oh I didn't see it that way, but I really like what you've done. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: And there are times, because you write for an artist too. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: I think there are times when you like your vision feels really specific as the writer and then there are times when it doesn't, and you're kind of like, I want this effect. What do you think? >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: How do you develop the ability to say with somebody who's working really like, how do you develop the ability to say this isn't quite what I meant. Because I have a feeling that I -- >> Faith Erin Hicks: I think you just have that ability. >> Linda Holmes: -- I have a feeling that if it were me that I would have a really hard time not just saying like It's all great [laughs] because -- >> Rainbow Rowell: It's easier to do it with someone you respect than with someone that you don't. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: Because if you respect someone and they feel that from you, it's actually, you're saying so many nice things too, and you have to. You have to speak up and say that's not quite it or this isn't quite landing correctly, because it gets personal otherwise. It has to be the book. The book has to be the important thing. The story has to be the important thing. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. And I feel like, I mean I always really appreciated your notes. Like, I don't feel like I ever disagreed with you. You know, I feel like you would give me your notes and I would just have better insight into that scene. So then I would go back and I would change it. And usually it was like really minor stuff. Like, this character is feeling this, so maybe change the expression to this. And I just, I don't know, I feel like it improved the work. And I'm always on board for that. You know, like of course it's more time consuming to work this way, but I feel like the work is better as a result of it. >> Rainbow Rowell: Chris Sanka, my Runaways partner for a long time, very nicely said, you demand a lot of emotional clarity. ^M00:16:152 [ Laughs ] ^M00:16:54 >> Rainbow Rowell: Because like, I often, I don't micro manage the panels usually except when there's a tight emotional moment. And that's the moment when I come in. Like there are probably two or three panels in Pumpkinheads that Faith and our editor at the time, Rachel Stark and I really talked about for about a week, because they're just the key moments where this relationship has to happen in a magical way. And there's really no language. It's pretty much all the paneling. And, you know, so we really needed to be on the same page. But in those moments, you really want it to be about the work, right. Everybody respects each other. We're talking about the work. There's no question that I respect Faith as a storyteller and as an artist, there's no question that she respects me as a storyteller and a writer. So then you can just talk about, is this landing? Is it what we're trying to do? >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: So I want to talk a little bit about your two characters. >> Rainbow Rowell: Okay, sure. Yeah, yeah. >> Linda Holmes: Your lead characters. You have been pretty straight forward the fact that you Based parts of Deja on your own best friend. >> Rainbow Rowell: That's right. Yeah. So you know. >> Linda Holmes: I do know. Yeah. And I get it. ^M00:17:57 [ Laughs ] ^M00:17:59 >> Linda Holmes: I get it. Did you have any hesitation about sort of not just basing a character on a - in part on a real person, but sort of saying that you had done that. Did you have any hesitation about what that would mean for -- >> Rainbow Rowell: This is such a lovely character. >> Linda Holmes: That's true. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. So this character is based on my best friend, Danielle. And it's just kind of her best qualities. So when I go out with Danielle she makes friends with everyone, and I make friends with no one. [Laughs] Like, no one makes sense with me unless they have to sit by me for six months or something, like prison or cafeteria situations. I don't make friends that easily. And Danielle makes friends with everyone. So we get into a cab and by the time we arrive, like they're going to go to the museum together, the driver and her. And like I don't understand that kind of charisma. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: And I don't understand that sort of like charm. And so this character Deja has that charm that Danielle has where everybody just immediately kind of like, hey's it's Deja. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: So I mean, I knew I was creating a lovable character, so I guess I didn't feel, and I told her, I told her. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: And she's super happy about it I think, actually. >> Linda Holmes: She has talked about it. She has indeed talked about it. >> Rainbow Rowell: She has talked about it.. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: And I made the character tall, because Danielle is tall. >> Linda Holmes: I actually thought about that because at the end of the book in the conversation that's printed between the two of you. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: You talk about the fact that Faith's original sketch of Deja was a little bit shorter. >> Rainbow Rowell: Right. >> Linda Holmes: And that you had asked for Deja to be taller. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: And when I read that, I thought, well for one thing, Danielle's very tall. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: Part of her, like whole, I think of it as like, it's part of her whole thing. >> Rainbow Rowell: It's here whole charisma. Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: Like, part of her whole thing, like. >> Rainbow Rowell: She's making friends and she's not even here. ^M00:19:46 [ Laughs ] ^M00:19:48 >> Linda Holmes: People out there is like what's her number? >> Rainbow Rowell: I know. That's through we fine, but I want to hit, I'm going to meet that. Danielle [inaudible] too. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. ^M00:19:54 [ Laughs ] ^M00:19:55 >> Linda Holmes: So with Josiah, how did you go about kind of building that since he comes into it as a little bit hang dog. If I can say that. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: He's a little pitiful at the beginning in his, you know -- >> Rainbow Rowell: Well, he's more of my stock character, frankly. ^M00:20:10 [ Laughs ] ^M00:20:12 >> Linda Holmes: He's trying to sort of like get up the nerve to talk to someone who's interested in. how did you sort of balance his kind of that nature with also making him appealing and lovable? Because I always worry about how like -- >> Rainbow Rowell: Every, okay, so every book I've written, I have been asked by an editor or someone in the process to make like the main character less pathetic. ^M00:20:35 [ Laughs ] ^M00:20:37 >> Rainbow Rowell: Everyone. Lincoln. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: In Attachments I was told just cut some of the nerd stuff. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: Cut the D and D stuff, but now it's like so fashionable to put it in. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: But I was specifically asked to cut the dungeons and the dragons scenes from that book, because he seemed like such a nerd. And then in Landline I had to, my agent was like, could you just make her shower more? She seems very pathetic. ^M00:20:55 [ Laughs ] ^M00:20:58 >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: I had a little bit of that about -- >> Rainbow Rowell: Landline? >> Faith Erin Hicks: -- about, no, about Evie. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, about Evie from your editor? >> Faith Erin Hicks: That she was a little - no, not very much from her, but from some people that she was a little bit like inert. Like a little bit like, I don't know, like interior. >> Rainbow Rowell: I feel very defensive on your behalf. >> Faith Erin Hicks: In a certain way. We didn't really change it though. She is who she is. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. It's part of who she is. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And that's still true of I think Lincoln and [inaudible]. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, I wrote more dungeons and dragons scenes. Don't ask me to change something ever. >> Faith Erin Hicks: No, it's just. >> Rainbow Rowell: Don't ever ask me to change it. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Now it's just spite dungeons. >> Rainbow Rowell: It is totally spite. I mean, the biggest one Simon is someone was like, he's way too pathetic. He's whined so much, and I was like, what is, his life is really hard. ^M00:21:39 [ Laughs ] ^M00:21:40 >> Rainbow Rowell: Luke Skywalker whines a lot. ^M00:21:42 [ Laughs ] ^M00:21:43 >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. So I don't know . >> Faith Erin Hicks: [Inaudible] to get the power converter. >> Rainbow Rowell: Right. ^M00:21:47 [ Laughs ] ^M00:21:50 >> Faith Erin Hicks: All right. >> Rainbow Rowell: Very good. >> Faith Erin Hicks: I'm a nerd. >> Rainbow Rowell: It did not occur to me or to Faith that he was too pathetic. >> Faith Erin Hicks: No. >> Rainbow Rowell: We both identified with him. >> Faith Erin Hicks: No. Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: Not pathetic, but just like he's a little bit like I don't know, like -- >> Faith Erin Hicks: I mean, I'm exactly like [inaudible] you know. ^M00:22:03 [ Laughs ] ^M00:22:06 >> Faith Erin Hicks: Like I have never in my life talked to someone I had a crush on. My husband asked me out over email. ^M00:22:11 [ Laughs ] ^M00:22:14 >> Linda Holmes: Digging myself deeper into the hole. >> Rainbow Rowell: I do know. Okay. Here's what I do think. I think people who are that charismatic, my best friend is this charismatic woman and I am like [inaudible]. You know, so like it's very natural that someone that charismatic is going to be drawn to someone that not, because they balance each other out. So yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: I mean literally it's like, you know that cartoon where it's like, you know, an extrovert adopts an introvert. Like that's how I feel. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> The only reason I have friends or I go out is because this extrovert like descended from on high. >> Linda Holmes: The little doggy on top of the big dog? >> Faith Erin Hicks: You know, yeah. Yeah. And just like, you know, hold me. >> Rainbow Rowell: You're like the rescue human. [Laughs] >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah, hold me until society. I mean. >> Linda Holmes: I do want to make sure that we get to some questions. There are microphones here and here. If you guys want to line up, we will -- >> Rainbow Rowell: We're going, I'm sorry. -- >> Linda Holmes: No, go ahead. >> Rainbow Rowell: I was going to say we will try to answer your questions so that we get to as many as you can. I have kind of a bad announcement, and that is that I knocked, I was doing a PBS interview and I knocked the lamp onto my head. >> Oh. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. And it hurt a lot and it kind of still hurts. So I'm not going to be signing, which I feel really bad about, but I almost didn't come. But I'm here. We're going to answer questions. Yeah. ^M00:23:28 [ Applause ] ^M00:23:30 >> Rainbow Rowell: And I'm going to need you all to carry me out. It's going to take this half of the -- >> Linda Holmes: The first question should be, Rainbow, I came 700 miles -- >> Rainbow Rowell: I know. I'm coming back to Fairfax, Virginia I think in October, assuming like that I don't have a horrible concussion, which I don't think I do because I've had a horrible concussion before and it felt a little different. But, Faith has the Wayward Son book plates. And again, I honestly feel really dreadful about it, so I'm so sorry. I'm sorry. >> Linda Holmes: You should not. The lamp should feel bad. >> Rainbow Rowell: PBS should feel bad, I think. I mean -- ^M00:23:58 [ Laughs ] ^M00:24:00 >> Faith Erin Hicks: I can maybe like approximate Rainbow [inaudible]. >> Rainbow Rowell: I don't mind. Let Faith sign your books. Okay. Right. >> Linda Holmes: Oh, yes. Let's go over here. Let's hear it, ma'am. >> Hunter: Okay. >> Rainbow Rowell: I like your shirt. >> Hunter: Thanks. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Hunter: My name is Hunter. >> Rainbow Rowell: Hello. >> Hunter: First of all, you liked my tweet yesterday about how your signing was during the poetry was turned out to be fine, so it's great. What I was going to ask how do you balance working with reading for pleasure, especially if you had to read books in high school, like a book a month. Like how do you read for pleasure and also do that? [Laughs] >> Rainbow Rowell: How do you balance, what was the first thing, writing? >> Hunter: Well, like work or, yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Writing as a job and for pleasure. I mean I can start us off. >> Rainbow Rowell: Go for it. Yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: I mean, I love comics, and I also make comics. And sometimes it's really hard. Like a lot of times I'll read a graphic novel and I'll be like, oh, I wouldn't have made that choice, you know, and it kinda ruins the book for me. What actually I read a lot of is Manga. Because it's from a different country. It's comics from Japan. And stylistically it's very, very different from the work that I'm producing. So typically I seek out work that is just very different from my own. And that's how I read for, I read comics for pleasure while also doing comics as a job. >> Rainbow Rowell: Well, I think, unfortunately you have to read and write a lot to be good at writing. And so I feel like especially when you're younger, even though it's tempting to be like, I just want to be a writer, you kind of have to be a reader first. You have to like really digest a bunch of good writing before you can even get there. It is hard when you're working a book. I don't know if you've felt this Evie, but when or Evie. When you were working on Evie, but when you are editing a book it's hard to read I think because all you see your problems. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: Yes. I think that's right. And also I got to interview Judy Bloom one phone. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh nice. >> Linda Holmes: And she told me that she doesn't read novels while she's writing a novel. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: Because it's too tempting for her. And I was sitting there thinking like, why would that be? And she said, well, because it's too easy for me to read something and say like, well this is so good and I am nothing. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. Wow. >> Linda Holmes: She's Judy Bloom. [Laughs] So clearly it happens to everyone. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Sorry, I'm short. I'm also sorry you're short. ^M00:26:20 [ Laughs ] ^M00:26:22 >> Hi. >> Rainbow Rowell: Hi. >> So I'm really excited to hear. Sorry. I was wondering at what point, like when you're writing, Rainbow, and also Faith when you're drawing, like at what point do you feel like as someone who might've been like a stock character kind of like comes alive for you and becomes like, do they come to you fully formed or do you feel like it's as you're writing they're coming alive at the same time? >> Rainbow Rowell: Usually in every book I have one character who I didn't think was going to be a very big character who just kind of breaks out. Like in Attachments it's Lincoln's friend Justin, and then in Eleanor and Park, it's Park's dad. And it's almost always a character who's nothing like me. And I realize how much I enjoy writing characters who aren't like me. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. For me, so I'm going to talk strictly as an artist. When I started designing characters that are going to go in the book, like they start out real rough. And then it's like I get to know them as I draw them more, and I become more familiar with them. So I know for me it's just like having them in my head and constantly trying to put them on the paper in front of me. And it's usually a pretty long process. Deja and Josiah I feel like came like their book came together pretty quickly, but I feel like that was because I had Rainbow's input as well. When I'm working on my own. So I'm thinking, especially of my series, The Nameless City, that one, oh my gosh, I did not finalize the look of the characters until I was literally sitting down to draw, start drawing the graphic novel, and I had like a deadline. [Laughs] So, you know, sometimes they just don't come very quickly at all, but just becoming familiar with the characters, getting to know them, spending more time with them. >> Linda Holmes: Yep. All right. >> Thank you. >> Thank you so much for coming, especially 'cause of the lamp thing. That would totally happen to me too. >> Rainbow Rowell: It's okay. I did it to myself. >> What is your, all of your ideas of a perfect Sunday? >> Rainbow Rowell: The perfect Sunday? >> Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: D-A-E or D-A-Y? >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> D-A-Y. >> Rainbow Rowell: Rocky Road. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah, Rocky Road. I like sleeping in. I like playing with my cat. I like hanging out with my husband playing video games. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. I just read Fan Fiction. ^M00:28:33 [ Laughs ] ^M00:28:36 [ Applause ] ^M00:28:38 >> Rainbow Rowell: Sunday and Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday. >> Linda Holmes: Yep. Good read. Good dog. >> Well first of all, I loved Pumpkinheads and I read it twice this week. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Oh, thank you. >> Once for myself and once for my son. >> Rainbow Rowell: Thank you. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yay. >> Who adored it. And Maryland has an okay pumpkin patch. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, really. Okay. >> I know who hears [inaudible] like Butler's [inaudible]. >> Rainbow Rowell: Okay. Good. >> But I want to go to Omaha. >> Faith Erin Hicks: She doesn't believe you. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah, I believe you. Then you won't need to come into ours. ^M00:29:01 [ Laughs ] ^M00:29:04 >> But I wanted to ask you, and I was really interested in the collaborative notes at the end. And in particular, you know, especially when you factor in deadlines and stuff like that. And the two of you working together for two years on this book. How do other members of the team, like an editor factor into the -- >> Rainbow Rowell: All right. >> -- equation, and how do you then make sure that you're meeting your milestones and deadlines? >> Rainbow Rowell: Well, we had a month, we had weekly meetings on this book. We had project meetings, which is a little unusual, but which I really wanted. And so like our editor and then later the colorist, then we would review color notes. So for me, those weekly meetings were really vital to keep us on the same page. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah, I feel like that was, those were the things that really kept us on track. And at first we weren't having them. >> Rainbow Rowell: Right. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And the book was not going as smoothly as it did later on. But I feel like once we had set aside time every week to talk, like on the phone that just became incredibly important. ^M00:30:01 So I feel like the general answer with every collaboration is you need to communicate with your partner. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, totally. Totally, totally, totally. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: They sit with my Marvel partners as well. Like, as soon as possible I try to get their phone number. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: And see if they'll let me text them, [laughs] because when you're going through an editor to talk to a collaborator, it just doesn't, it is not as natural. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. Yeah >> Rainbow Rowell: All right. We're going to, sorry, let's, I want to get them. >> Linda Holmes: Yeah, absolutely. We're going to try to -- >> Rainbow Rowell: Thank you for your question. >> Linda Holmes: Thank you very much. >> Yeah, thank you. >> Linda Holmes: We're going over here. >> Hi. So I have a question about Carry On, if that's all right. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. Faith, you want to take this one? ^M00:30:36 [ Laughs ] ^M00:30:38 >> Faith Erin Hicks: I'm ready. >> Rainbow Rowell: You probably could after listening to me talk all week. Let's hear it. >> In Carry On you take a lot of like fantasy clichés and tropes and you kind of turn them on their head. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> And I was wondering, like, how you were able to do that? And, like, what was the process of -- >> Rainbow Rowell: You mean like story tropes? >> Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. I think I've just read so many [inaudible] in one stories. My first fandom was the Bible. ^M00:30:59 [ Laughs ] ^M00:31:01 >> Rainbow Rowell: It was very into Jesus. He's the first -- >> Faith Erin Hicks: Who did [inaudible]? >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, gosh, Faith. ^M00:31:06 [ Laughs ] ^M00:31:07 >> Rainbow Rowell: Don't be gross. ^M00:31:08 [ Laughs ] ^M00:31:10 >> Rainbow Rowell: But I just feel like I've had Chosen One stories. I've been digesting Chosen Ones stories my whole life. I was, my first actual fandom was Star Wars. You know, another Chosen One story. I got very into Lord of the Rings. I got very into Harry Potter, [scream] so when it, whew, I'm glad we have some Harry Potter fans in the House. [Laughs] Whew, Harry Potter. Okay. Come on. Save it for [inaudible]. [Laughs] So I really think when I sat down to write Fan Girl, and I started writing this little snippets, when I was done, I realized I had a lot more to say about the Chosen - you know, that time I'm like 40 years old. I spent my whole adult and childhood reading these stories and kind of chewing on them. And I realized that when I started talking about these chosen one tropes, it just was like, oh, I had so much to say. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: I had so much to say specifically about how young people in those stories don't have many choices. So the chosen one almost never has a choice. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: And so that's how it happened. Thank you for your question. >> Thank you. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Thank you. >> Hi. I love both of your work separately. So when I saw you're going to be working together, I was like this is a match made in heaven. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Awesome. >> Rainbow Rowell: Thank you. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Thank you so much. >> You both have such good characterization in your novels, but Rainbow, I know like in Landline, so much of what goes on with Georgie is so internal. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> And graphic novels are generally very much dialogue. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> So in your process, how did you, I know you all talked about facial expressions, but how did you really make sure that came forward? And, Faith, with yours you got to know these characters too, so were there any ever any points where you're like pushed back and were like specific instances where you're like, no, I really feel like they would do this instead or maybe do this? >> Faith Erin Hicks: No, no, I definitely didn't push back on any story or characterization moments in the book. And I feel like the original script was actually quite internal. You know, Rainbow gave me a lot of emotional direction. She told me, you know, their thought process, what they were going through at that particular moment. And my challenge is to draw it. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And that is the great challenge of comics. I feel like, you know, it's like the pictures are the words. So I do feel like there are scenes in Pumpkinheads. Like I'm especially thinking of if you've read the book, there's a scene where Josiah and Deja are sitting in a cornfield, and it's literally like 20 pages of them sitting in this cornfield and they do talk, but there are a lot of silent panels where they are dealing with their own internal emotions. And those, that's when comics are internal. It's just the characters are feeling those things in the visual format rather than using pros. >> Rainbow Rowell: I totally agree. Yeah. Well said. >> Faith Erin Hicks: All right. >> Hey, I was wondering if there were any ever alternative titles for Pumpkinhead? >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Oh, yeah, quite a few. >> Rainbow Rowell: Actually yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: It was first going to be called Last Night at the Patch, because it's their last night and it was also what happened last night. And my editor did not like that. [Laughs] And then we went on a long title journey with lots and lots of titles and I came up with Pumpkinheads almost as a joke, but it was one of those times you'd come up with like a joke [inaudible]. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: My editor really did not like it. ^M00:34:16 [ Laughs ] ^M00:34:17 >> Rainbow Rowell: Faith and I liked it. It's like the one time we sort of conspired against [inaudible]. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: Because I would like say to Faith like, okay, you tell her you like it. [Laughs] I'll tell her, and whenever it would come up we'd be like, well, what about Pumpkinhead. We just wore her down. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And this, sorry, I hopefully it's okay to bring this up, but there's actually like an old horror movie called Pumkinhead. And, yeah, I guess people like it. So I feel like that was kind of the thing nipping at our heels, although I feel like Pumpkinheads [inaudible]. >> Rainbow Rowell: It doesn't bother me at all. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: I don't care. >> Faith Erin Hicks: But now that the book is drawn, I somewhat regret not including Lance Hendrickson in the background [laughs] of any of the panels. So anyway. >> Rainbow Rowell: Thank you. >> Hi. So I know one of the things that would really make my life is just, you know, my favorite books when made into movies or TV shows or whatever. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, yeah. >> And I was wondering if you guys have a preference for what medium your works are trying to do, whether it's like TV show, movie, stage plays, musicals? >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, please, I want a musical, right? [Laughs] I mean, are you taking orders? I'd like [inaudible]. >> Faith Erin Hicks: [Laughs] I think Pumpkinheads would make a great musical. >> Rainbow Rowell: Make a lovely musical. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah, it really, really would. >> Rainbow Rowell: I'm on it. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: I think it's kind of like you're like you're in a way how you feel about your kids. You just want them to do well. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: You don't care where they end up. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: So like, I don't know. It's kind of a, it's always a gamble. I've had things optioned and nothing happened. So at this point in my career I feel like, well, if it ever happens, I just hope they do a good job. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Yeah. >> Okay, cool. Thank you. >> Rainbow Rowell: Thank you. >> Faith Erin Hicks: Thank you. >> I was wondering who your favorite Runaway character is and why? >> Rainbow Rowell: My favorite Runaways character is Victor Mancha. I used to pretend that I didn't. In fact, Chris Sanka had a favorite character, that's Carolina Dean. And I used to like say, you're not allowed to say that publicly. [Laughs] It's blatant favoritism, and you can't do that. These are my children. But then it became obvious that Victor Mancha was my favorite, and I feel like I'm not going to quit that book until everyone loves Victor as much as they love Wolverine. [Laughs] So that's my mission. ^M00:36:12 [ Laughs ] ^M00:36:13 >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, and it's because he's wonderful. He's a sweetheart. He wants to be good. We maybe have time for one or two more. >> Yeah. Hi, my question is for Rainbow, and it's -- >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> -- about Landline -- >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, sure. >> -- as a wife and a mother is my favorite work. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, thank you. Gosh. >> I'm curious if you have considered if Landline is in the same universe as Carry On, because the way the telephone works to me seems in keeping with the magic of Carry On, it being an object in view of power. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, wow. That's a great idea. I have always thought Landline, Fan Girl, Attachments, and Eleanor and Park are in the same universe. And then someone pointed out to me that that means magic exists in that universe because there's a magic fucking phone. ^M00:36:54 [ Laughs ] ^M00:36:57 >> Rainbow Rowell: But you've just opened up a whole new possibility. [Laughs] I think I like your idea better. Should we do one more? >> Linda Holmes: All right, one more. >> I was really just wondering, I really like to write, but right now I am just have no ideas. Where do you get your inspiration and all your wonderful ideas, because I love all your books and it's just, yeah. >> Rainbow Rowell: Oh, this is a hard question. I always say that I work, I get my inspiration from stuff I need to work on. So every book I write as a problem that I have. And if you're like, why would she ever write about that? Like why would she write that? I think like the answer is, oh, she's working something out. She's got some problems she's working on. It's always that. >> Faith Erin Hicks: For me, a lot of times I'm actually, so like I write typically I write my comics that are typically for teens or for middle grade. And a lot of times I'm inspired by things that I liked as a kid, but I am, I was, I liked the thing that I also was frustrated by it. So, like as a kid I was a real nerd. and I love science fiction and action and adventure. And typically those genres, we're incredibly male dominated. So it was like now that I'm a creator, I get to go in there and I get to make action, adventure. I haven't made a science fiction story yet, but I'd like to someday. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Faith Erin Hicks: And it's like, but I get to make those stories with girls in them, girls and women. And that's something that's really wonderful [inaudible]. ^M00:38:17 [ Applause ] ^M00:38:20 >> Linda Holmes: And it's funny that you guys say this, because I would, and I would agree with both of them, because Rainbow's point about problems., when I sat down to write a book, it's all about starting with the person who is in a predicament. I've been saying when I talk about this book, it's a person with a predicament. That's where I tend to start. And in terms of what Faith was saying people ask me, why did you write like a romantic comedy? And I said, because I love them but they also make me crazy, because [inaudible] about them. So it's, it's that opportunity to kind of [inaudible]. >> Faith Erin Hicks: You have the power when you're a creator. >> Rainbow Rowell: Yeah. >> Linda Holmes: I am so sorry that we don't have time to get everybody. I appreciate you all so much. I'm so glad we could do this. Thank you, Rainbow. Thank you, Faith. >> Rainbow Rowell: Thank you, Linda. Thank you. [Applause]